Pre season training discussion

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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by villabromsgrove on Mon Jul 18, 2016 10:30 am

I know there's still six weeks of this transfer window left to conduct business, both ins and outs. However, by the time the window closes we will already have played five fixtures. If we drop too many points out of those fifteen available while we're still sorting things, it could prove damaging.
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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by Sandie on Mon Jul 18, 2016 12:17 pm

I agree to a point, it could probably stretch beyond that early season period to considering how long it might take a heavily revised side to gel. In an ideal world, you would have most of pre-season to get the players working together. However, I can't think of any side who has ever managed that because of how the transfer window is.

As things stand, we've brought in a goalkeeper, a centre half and a central midfielder. That's a striker away from an entirely new spine. Even to do that much business this early is a good sign. The only issue that's for debate is the quality of those signings, really.
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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by villabromsgrove on Wed Jul 20, 2016 9:53 pm

1-1 result tonight. It was a good workout and I think RDM/SC/KB will now be learning a lot about our players. The major point that we've been hammering home is that Jordan Ayew must not be sold! There were also some interesting positional changes such as Okore moving to right back in the second half. Grealish seemed to be the main mover and shaker according to text coverage.

FC Nantes up next on Saturday, bring it on.

How about acknowledging that Villa are currently playing football matches AVTV?
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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by villabromsgrove on Sat Jul 23, 2016 6:54 pm

That's the end of a first half which could have been from any one of last season's matches (apart from the sunshine). Only Ayew and Gollini came out of that with any credit. Let's hope we play some assisters in the second half.

Has Eric Black really left us?
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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by Sandie on Sat Jul 23, 2016 7:14 pm

Reinforcements beginning to look even more essential.
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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by Jim Villan on Sat Jul 23, 2016 7:33 pm

It can only be a good thing if westwards lack of creativity has been exposed today. It crucial that RD gets rid of the ineffective players over the next couple of weeks, or at leasts have a clear understanding of who are more effective players are.
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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by villabromsgrove on Sat Jul 23, 2016 8:11 pm

One shot on target, one goal. The lack of creative play to the forwards is extremely worrying. The shape of the team seems to mean that Hutton and Cissokho are charged with getting forward and getting the crosses in. We all knows that doesn't work .... watch last seasons videos again Roberto!
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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by villabromsgrove on Sat Jul 23, 2016 8:37 pm

RDM's insistence on giving players a clean slate and then waiting to judge them with his own eyes is back firing on him.

We have just two weeks until we start our promotion campaign and RDM/SC have arrived at the very same system (and most of the same players) that got us relegated last year.

The facts and stats and videos would have told them what we all knew .... this bunch of players and this system is not good enough for even lower league football.

We should have started sorting these problems weeks ago, instead we've wasted invaluable time.
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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by Mr Natterjack on Sat Jul 23, 2016 8:50 pm

I don't think we learned anything that we didn't already know there.

Gestede bailed us out with a goal which he's capable of. Nantes dominated in terms of shots and possession.. the first half showed that having Gueye and Westwood in front of the defence doesn't actually offer protection to the back 4 whilst sacrificing our own attack, and just allows the opposition to come at us. Also, having no specific attacking midfielders or wide men (we played so narrow, especially in the first half) makes it almost impossible for the strikers to come into the game. I can't remember a single key pass played to either Ayew or Gestede in 90 minutes (Veretout almost slipped Gestede in). With a player like Gestede, you need to at least have one left or right sided midfielder widening play and whipping in balls to supply him occasionally.. the management failed to understand this for the whole of last season.

Was impressed by Baker today- great in the air and good header across to Gestede for his goal. Elphick looked reliable, Ayew was sharp, Gestede played his part with the goal, but overall the midfield left a lot to be desired and we looked far too much like last season. Still feel we could do with a proven quality midfielder who's a creator and match winner to help put us on the front foot in games, to inject much needed confidence into the team.
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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by Sandie on Sat Jul 23, 2016 8:54 pm

If we got rid of all our ineffective players we wouldn't have many left.

Bacuna got a game today, FFS!
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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by Sandie on Sat Jul 23, 2016 8:57 pm

Spot on, Mr. N. Tish aside, our midfield concerns me. I'm one of few not to rate Gueye. His stats are good but he's not an effective defensive midfielder in a number of measures.
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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by villabromsgrove on Sat Jul 23, 2016 9:03 pm

Sandie wrote:Spot on, Mr. N. Tish aside, our midfield concerns me. I'm one of few not to rate Gueye. His stats are good but he's not an effective defensive midfielder in a number of measures.
Gana was a liability today. When he wasn't giving the ball away he was hacking players down. He would have had at least two yellows in a league match.
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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by Mr Natterjack on Sat Jul 23, 2016 9:17 pm

Yeah, for me Gueye's really poor distribution and inability to impose himself on the game makes him a weak player. His interception stats from last season should make him sellable, and I think the Kante comparisons from the media (based purely on the misleading interception stats) will make him attractive to a buyer before the transfer window closes (so many scouts are recommending players based on the kind of stats listed on whoscored.com these days and getting it wrong- we made the same mistake when we bought him). I think Tshibola will be an upgrade if he slots into the role. I still rate Gueye ahead of Westwood but that's not much of a compliment. The sooner we realise you only need one dedicated defensive midfielder to shield the defence, partnered with more of a box-to-box midfielder in the center, the better.

Also today, I don't think anyone could say we had a clear tactical strategy for scoring a goal.. similar to last season, we were relying on a goal to come out of nowhere rather than clearly having certain patterns of play to guarantee regular goals. A lot of work to do, 2 weeks to go.
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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by villabromsgrove on Sun Jul 24, 2016 10:46 am

Mr Natterjack wrote:Yeah, for me Gueye's really poor distribution and inability to impose himself on the game makes him a weak player. His interception stats from last season should make him sellable, and I think the Kante comparisons from the media (based purely on the misleading interception stats) will make him attractive to a buyer before the transfer window closes (so many scouts are recommending players based on the kind of stats listed on whoscored.com these days and getting it wrong- we made the same mistake when we bought him). I think Tshibola will be an upgrade if he slots into the role. I still rate Gueye ahead of Westwood but that's not much of a compliment. The sooner we realise you only need one dedicated defensive midfielder to shield the defence, partnered with more of a box-to-box midfielder in the center, the better.

Also today, I don't think anyone could say we had a clear tactical strategy for scoring a goal.. similar to last season, we were relying on a goal to come out of nowhere rather than clearly having certain patterns of play to guarantee regular goals. A lot of work to do, 2 weeks to go.
I agree that we should never play with more than one holding midfielder. As for not having a tactical plan for scoring a goal, I actually think we did. Unfortunately it consisted of Hutton high up the right side of the pitch with both hands in the air demanding the ball. The two crosses he managed to make went straight to the keeper! At least Elphick was moving over to cover the right, with Hutton up the pitch for large portions of the game, but that meant that the ineffective Westwood was dropping deep to cover Elphick's space.

It's strange how we can go through three different managers but the game plan remains exactly the same. I guess it will as long as Hutton, Westwood and Gueye are named on the team sheet.
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Re: Pre season training discussion

Post by Sandie on Sun Jul 24, 2016 2:00 pm

At least players are now covering, that's progress of a sort!

The big re-building project we were promised and that we desperately need seems to have sadly stalled.
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